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CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

Back by popular demand. This is a format that will reward being a diverse player and still be viable fo r the NLHE player.
I plan on grilling before the game, free food if you bring food, i got the hamburgers; post what you plan on bringing. Also if you've never been to a game give me a call with any questions- 970-3425.

DATE: 07-21-07
TIME: (12:30- Potluck-lunch) 1:00 registration, 1:30 game time
FORMAT: IRON MAN
BUY-IN: $50 /w optional $50 sidebet

Registration 24 players max
EVENT 1: 30 min 2000c: Heads Up NLHE
EVENT 2: 1 hr 1500c: PL Omaha
EVENT 3: 1 hr 1500c: 7 Card Stud
EVENT 4: 1 hr 1000c: Limit Hold em
EVENT 5: +1000c 20min blinds: No Limit Texas Hold em

HOW IT WORKS: For each event you will get a set amount of chips, each table/pair will play a set amount of time. Chip totals will be recorded for each event. You will get an additional 1000 chips plus the total of chips from the previous events for the FINAL NLHE event.

Example:
................TIM.....TODD
HU...........3500......500..... Todd and I are paired but can't finish him off.
OMAHA.....7000......0........ I do very well, Todd.. not so much.
7 Card........0........2500.... I get knocked out, Todd almost doubles.
Limit.........1000.....3700.... I'm not a limit player so i pay blinds and Todd is Mr. Flush.

SubTotal...11500....6700.... We each get an extra 1000c and end up with
TOTAL......12500....7700..... The Holdem game goes from these starting chips.

Q & A:

Q: If I get knocked out of an event what happens?
A: You'll record a 0 for that event and watch TV till the next event.

Q: How will the heads up event work?
A: Everyone will be paired randomly by card draw; you'll stay paired for that event.

Q: What about blinds?
A: Blinds will be incrimated by time ex. the heads up event will be 30 minutes with blinds incrementing every 10 minutes . 25/50 50/100 75/150

Q: What about the final NLHE event?
A: Well, seats are drawn for each event including this one. the only difference is that this event will start at the 4th blind (100/200) and be 20 min timed blinds there forward.

Q: The side bet is what?
A: It's a whole nother payout for the same tournament. If 7 people are in the side (7*50=350) it would payout like a 7 man tournament and the top two finishers in that set of people would cash. (1st = $225, 2nd = $125). So you could theroreticly be out 5th and still be 1st in the side. This allows people to play a $50 game and others to play a $100 game.

RSVP LIST

ChuckO- Ham

friarchucko · Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 8:33 am Post subject:

Tim , how would shaved ham be , for during the game? Sort of like the other time? I know it helped me when I had to wait around. Oh , did I leave a tray there? I know I left cash Exclamation

And one more thing , I will not play Cory heads up again Laughing

The last two times you held it, it was he and I, no more Exclamation

Please let us play someone else Exclamation

PLEASE

I do think Cory thinks the same way Question

_________________
Who says playing cards is bad for you -
just look at this body !!

BenGPsycho · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 3:24 am Post subject:

I'm in, so RSVandP me now, lil man... I will bring some cold salads, like potato salad or something, and some chips and crap... I can't wait to play it man... Later...

AsianInvasion

DANNO · Crabs 33 Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 62 Location: Hartland

I just might be in town for a party at the out(in)laws and it would be awesome to get out of that. At least I'd be making the drive with the wife and have a driver for the 2 hour drive home after I beer up. I will definatly work on this. I just need to tell her I won after, so I hope I don't have to lie.

Hope to see ya then.
_________________
The less you bet, the more you lose when you win.

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

Danno is coming!!!!

waterboy · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:41 pm Post subject:

I will just be getting back from vacation and will need to make some more money. Since Danno will be there, he seems like a good candidate to fill my pockets. See you there. I might even bring Amy. -
The original Todd 1.
_________________
I've gone to find myself. If I should return before I get back, keep me here.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Quad Todd and Danno.... Sounds like some Original GRAmPA mother -beep- are getting back together for a good old tournament.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

Big T · Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 7:49 am Post subject:

Hopefully I can make it for this, if the wife will let me. I think I am playing poker too much lately!

Or she thinks so!
_________________
Todd H.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Aren't addictions great...
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

JasonSLash · Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:50 pm Post subject:

50/50 chance with me.........
_________________
Jason Lash
www.GRHomes.Net
E-mail at Jason.Lash@GRHomes.net

resonator · Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 2:57 am Post subject:

We need some Razz, 2-7 Lowball or Stud High/Low Split 8 or better!!! I've never played them, but I've read books dammit. Wheeeeee ....

PS. Is the stud going to be high card bringing it in or low card?
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

Big T · Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:02 pm Post subject:

Stud is the low card bring in. Razz is fun, we should play it.
_________________
Todd H.

mbreon · Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject:

waterboy · Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 4:34 pm Post subject:

Razz is good game to add. It's a fun game and makes you think more. I would be good with adding this to the mix. So far it looks like I'll be there.
_________________
I've gone to find myself. If I should return before I get back, keep me here.

Ionia · Ducks 22 Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 25

If you're going to add Razz, why not setup a HORSE event. For the NLHE fans, you could still have the final segment be NLHE. In stead of telling the wife you were doing an IRONMAN, you could just say you were HORSE'N around.

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

I hate razz. No razz.

resonator · Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:58 pm Post subject:

No Razz, but I do have a last longer prop bet with Spike for this event now. Who ever loses the last longer bet at the Ironman will have to wear a dress to the League Finals. He's going to look perty.
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

Yesterdog · Newbie Joined: 16 Jul 2007 Posts: 1 Location: Hudsonville

Yeah count me in, where's it at?

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

My house, call me at 970-3425

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

tommorow

BenGPsycho · Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 10:36 am Post subject:

1 hour until munchie time... Good luck everyone, well, except for Tim, cause he hates Razz... Hey guys, if we get enough interest, we should start a home game somewhere that includes Razz, 2-7, Stud Split, etc... I would be very interested in throwing all of my money to you guys in new games that we don't really get a chance of playing... See ya in a few...

AsianInvasion

resonator · Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 7:49 pm Post subject:

Hey Ben, our Omaha hand was 58.7% to 41.3%. I'm pretty sure that I wasn't double suited in anything so I four suited myself, but if I was double suited in somthing it would have bumped me up to 60.4% so I was about right on the math. Had to look it up though, I don't know Omaha nearly as well as 'Hold 'Em.

Also, though technically you were right to call on the end knocking me out, getting 6:1 on the call. You had only 11.3% to win but also 20.8% to chop so you were behind about 4:1 with chop equity split evenly making a good call. I don't like it though because you could easily be drawing dead or had a bunch of your outs counterfeited if another club came. What do I know though ... when the cards got flipped up it turned out you were right to call ...
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

BenGPsycho · Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 10:14 pm Post subject:

Don't forget that I was playing loose as hell the entire night... I took down alot of pots and knocked out alot of people with bogus calls, so yeah, sorry... I just played what my gut told me to do, and alot of times it ended up being right...

So anyways, I won the tournament if you haven't figured it out yet... Well, me and Chuck got heads up, but we decided to chop the pot, but give me the win since I had him about 5/3 chip stack wise... I will admit that I did donk off alot of hands, and I apologize to everyone whom I knocked out that way...

One final note, congratulations to Spike for his AI with the wheel being beaten by my quad 5s... He is the winner of one dress, and will be named "Hottest Chick" at League Finals... Please make sure to bring your cameras...

AsianInvasion

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

You know Ben of all the bad poker you were playing I figured that my rivered wheel was good to beat your trip 5's. It was bad enough that you sucked out just about every hand but the taunting is just tacky and its really to make me start to twitch and blackout again like I was doing after I left Tim's house....

I'm not sure if there has ever been a documented bigger streak of luckout suckout but if not this one should be submited to guiness...

As I understand it you and Chuck chopped. Good job to the both of you.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

resonator · Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:50 am Post subject:

resonator · Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 3:02 am Post subject:

Well Tom I guess that "give me the pot" comment with the quads was a little bit of taunting now that I think about it. It's sick thought to river a wheel and have to make a decision for all your chips with a paired board. Especailly when the turn was checked around. After I got my top pair called on the flop by both of you I knew it couldn't be good so the fold was easy for me despite my tilting nature at that point but folding a straight there is hard.
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

I knew it may not be my day when the heads up card that made my straight made Eric's flush. My chips there probably gave him just enough to give him pants for the final. But please do not blame me for you guys having to see Spike in a dress.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

RULES OF SEVEN-CARD STUD

1. The first round of betting starts with a forced bet by the lowest upcard by suit. On subsequent betting rounds, the high hand on board initiates the action (a tie is broken by position, with the player who received cards first acting first).

http://www.thepokerforum.com/sevencardstud.htm

Just in case anyone cares. Tim I'm curious as to what site you were looking at for rules on seven card stud. This is just one of the 100 sites I found that reference how betting is supose to go in seven card stud. I'm sure you all can do your own research and find the truth. Google is a wonderful tool.

And if you go to any site that has the rules posted correctly you are supose to burn a card between rounds of up cards and the last down card....

Last of course is the deal/button... If you go into any cash game or tournament on any of your online gaming sites you'll notice if there is a button that the button never moves because in seven card stud the deal never changes. the first seat is always the person to get the first card out of the deck.

So in short I was correct in all of the rules and if you want to learn to play stud please feel free to come to the Tom poker school of seven card stud... my fee for people who don't know the rules is much higher then it is for people who already know the rules.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Am I upset... yep. Do I hate Ben... not at all. I don't particularly like the game he was playing because everytime I hit a 5 card hand Ben ended up having a better one. Thats poker and I know eventually if I play well and make the right choices I will eventually beat him.

That last hand I had was pretty sick. I put Ben on one 5. So there for my wheel beats his trips. I'm not taking anything personally. I vented and I'm over it now.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

friarchucko · Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 11:36 am Post subject:

Here is a big thank you to Tim for Saturdays Ironman event. It was fun , well run and the only thing missing was half of those that said they were coming!! Although it did give those of us there , lots of food . And , those of us that was there , now know what Ben's big secret is!! Rolling Eyes

I all most feel slighted and it caught me off guard, when Ben said he would chop at the end Shocked

. But he said he thought it would take to long to whip me Embarassed

, and he wanted to go play eleswhere Exclamation

I said all most because the money made me forget === what was I taking about === oh ya money Exclamation

_________________
Who says playing cards is bad for you -
just look at this body !!

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

Another big thanks to Tim - the event allowed me to play games I rarely play (sorry for my slow thinking) which was enjoyable.

BenGPsycho · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 6:38 am Post subject:

Chuck, first of all, it wasn't because I thought I could beat you, it was because I know that even with my luck that I was having, my heads up game usually sucks... The only way I won the 1st event was by playing aggressive and pretty much hoping on luck when I get AI... Thank you for chopping, but letting me take the win... I appreciate it very much...

To Tom and Eric, along with everyone else, but you 2 are the ones who have mentioned it... I never meant to be taunting, and if I did seem that way, I apologize... I do realize that my play style is very harsh, but that aggressive style is how I play, and it ends up with the best results that I have... I do realize that the quote "Congratulations, you are the winner of a dress, I have quads" was a taunt, but I would normally not rub things in people's faces... The only reason I did so was the fact that you and Eric were both in that hand until the showdown, and the fact that he had a somewhat worried look on his face...

To everyone else, my main strategy for the afternoon was just to play hard and go strong or go broke... It worked through most of the events (i know, my stud game was pathetic, well, more pathetic than the rest of my game), and I am more surprised that most of the hands I played held up... I guess being tired, aggressive, and lucky is the key to the game... So, stay up dealing for 14 hours straight, then spend 4 hours online playing before you go and play a tournament, and you will do well... Either that or pass out into your chipstack... BTW Chuck, I was feeling a lil tired, which was another reason I wanted to chop... Wink

I had fun Tim, and I can't wait to play another "big" tourney ran by you... Maybe this time we can get it up to double digits... Wink

AsianInvasion

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Damn you... it did work. Good job. Damn you... I have to wear a dress..... damn quad 5's.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

Big T · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 9:23 am Post subject:

I don't know what it is lately, I keep getting people to make bad plays against me, draws, calling with only a pair in their hand, etc. But still get sucked out on by the time the river comes.

I will still take 85-90% going to the river but aren't I supposed to win 80-90% of those hands? I can't seem to win any of them.

Still not sure what happened on Saturday. Can't complain I wasn't getting cards that is for sure.
_________________
Todd H.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

I never get cards either.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

I never get cards either.

friarchucko · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:27 pm Post subject:

My cards are always lower than all of you guy's cards,cry cry cry. WOW that felt great Exclamation

_________________
Who says playing cards is bad for you -
just look at this body !!

resonator · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:45 pm Post subject:

Ben I know you don't mean anything by it, you're just having a good time, I'm not offended at all. If I have a problem with what you're doing I'll let you know, but the only time you've annoyed me is when I had to tell you to stay out of live pots that you're not in to make change. It bothered you when Tim tried to make change out of your stack during a hand in the NLHE part of the tournament. So the general rule of thumb is that if you don't want people acting a certain way towards you don't act that way towards them.

The reason I had the sick look on my face was because I knew my hand couldn't be any good. KJ on a flop of K54 and I bet and it gets called in two spots. The turn is another 5 and I check and it gets checked around. The next card is the A. I bet Ben raises, Tom calls which puts him all in and the action is back on me. The thing that makes me sick (and thus the look on my face) about this spot is my bet on the end. The only hand that I can get to call for a value bet on the end is a K9, K8 type hand ... BUT with the board paired and the A on the end the A plays and my J is no good. So, I really couldn't have gotten a worse hand to pay me off at all and I put the value bet on the end anyway. Then the subsequent action told me that my hand was sh*t, and I just wasted chips. Just a terrible play ..... I'm trying to get better, but sometimes I feel like I'm like a blind man feeling his way around in some kind medevial torture cellar just waiting to get impaled on something when I play poker.

Hope to see you all tonight for League.
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

mbreon · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:04 pm Post subject:

I never get cards either. I just try to win big pots with junky hands to make up for it.

Big T, you know you can't measure your results from one tournament, one weekend, or even one month. Poker is a game of the looooooong term.
_________________
"Everyone plays poker exactly the same way. As they please."

friarchucko · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:19 pm Post subject:

Eric , when you are in a hand , you keep me on my guard . Like what you just said , you thought your cards were bad but you still put out that bet just to see. I never know if you are just looking or looking to get more Evil or Very Mad

So I don't think you are a blindman just dancing around , I think you just want us to think that Rolling Eyes

_________________
Who says playing cards is bad for you -
just look at this body !!

friarchucko · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:24 pm Post subject:

Don't help Big T up , as long as he is down on himself, I have a chance to beat him. Twisted Evil

So Todd don't pay no mind to anyone , just stay down on yourself, at least for 2 more weeks , O K Rolling Eyes

_________________
Who says playing cards is bad for you -
just look at this body !!

mbreon · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:19 am Post subject:

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

mbreon · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:00 am Post subject:

I hear you, but I have played some H.O.R.S.E. tournaments online, and in each one, the button moves after every hand, regardless of game.

Yes I know position is irrelevant in Stud because there are bring in and completion bets. In a Stud only tournament, there would be no dealer button. In a H.O.R.S.E. tournamen though (at least the ones I have played), the button still does move for some reason. Perhaps it is only online tourmanents.....however that has been my experience. Not saying I am right, just saying that's what I know from what I have seen.
_________________
"Everyone plays poker exactly the same way. As they please."

ckbandit · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:14 am Post subject:

Button moves in stud only to indicate who gets dealt cards first.
_________________
"The new air conditioning is great, but I think it's cooling down my cards."
ckbandit.com

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

This really does not matter except for Tom to prove he is right.

At a home game where who deals moves, it is easiest to move also the first dealt card to not confuse the dealer. If the home game has a permanent non player dealer, then not moving the button makes sense.

With an adequate shuffle, it does not matter except for this practical reason. Because it does not matter is probably why everyone has different experiences to report.

Big T · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:46 am Post subject:

Tom we play in a home game, with no set dealer. Regardless of however it is done in a casino or whatever, the deal passes to the next player. So random becomes randomer! Is it the randomest?

Bottom line, drop it!

In any stud game that I have played in a home game the dealer button passes to the next player just like every other game.
_________________
Todd H.

theoriginalDave · 是我是donk Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 883

Just to stir the pot a little here is an opinion from another forum, makes sense to me:

ckbandit · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:58 am Post subject:

Didn't read/care to read the rest of the conversation. Just jumped in w/ my two cents regarding stud. Sorry.
_________________
"The new air conditioning is great, but I think it's cooling down my cards."
ckbandit.com

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Dave just for your information in a mixed game like HORSE the games change as the deal and or number hands you play make it around the table.... there is no time limit in a HORSE game. In any mixed game where any stud game is involved the deal maybe passed to keep track of the number of hands but the person who receives the first card never ever changes in any stud game. Of course there are some people that will continue to argue the Roberts rules of stud... even the people who quote Roberts rules are arguing... this is just funny and entertaining to me.

My stuborness can't possibly out do your combined effort of ignorance. The bottom line Todd is that there are rules for a real Stud game wheather you are at a home game or at a casino. You still play the same Casino style Hold'em in a home game just without a dealer... you all seem to know how to pull that one off without any issues. I am done. You'll either figure it out on your own or you'll choose to stay blissfully happy in your own ignorance. I could care less. And yes the home game rules are just home game rules... so just make sure you specify your home game rules on a specific game and I'll be sure not to show up. I would rather play the authentic game and get real practice at it or not play at all.

{{{DONE}}}
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

mbreon · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 11:53 am Post subject:

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

Tom, it says something about you that you would continue to argue about something that does not matter in the slightest.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

but yet you're justified in arguing it... even as a lawyer you have to realize its not an argument unless you have two sides.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

There is no argument - because it does not matter - as I keep saying.

Not part of an argument, but did you really find something about this in Robert's Rules - I thought I looked there a while back and found nothing.

mbreon · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 6:52 pm Post subject:

Me stating that in other tournaments I have played I have seen the button played differently does not constitute an "argument".

You are just argumentative Cool

_________________
"Everyone plays poker exactly the same way. As they please."

resonator · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:23 pm Post subject:

mbreon · Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject:

Yes - my name is Captain Obvious Laughing

_________________
"Everyone plays poker exactly the same way. As they please."

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

Hear was the original arguement:

Tom says, "The button dose not move in a casino game of stud"
Tim says, "In this game the buttons dose move"

These two statements are completely not related to each other they both can be right but it was insisted that i was wrong. Funny, how could I be wrong when i set the game up...

I realize that i may be staring this back up but i never got to add into this conversation.

Big T · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:27 am Post subject:

One slight mention though, we didn't burn a card between streets. You are supposed to burn a card, we missed that one.
_________________
Todd H.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Todd just so that you realize I did mention to everyone that there are burnt card in stud also but again no one cared enough to stop to listen... The combind effort of ignorance wins. But thank you for being the first one to point that out...

Where you went wrong Tim is your advertised the game as a stud game. There were so many crazy rule changes to what looked like stud that you can't call it or advertize it as a stud game.

Granted you can call it whatever you want. Just please make sure that when you put on this tournament again you specify that you're going to be playing the GRAMPA version of Stud before hand and I'll be sure not to show up as I stated before.

I'm not even arguing that you can play the game however you want. What I am saying is you're not playing stud and therefor the game is not authentic and should not be called stud... and therefor any practice you think you are getting will only betray you when and if you ever choose to play a real stud cash game or tournament.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

theoriginalDave · 是我是donk Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 883

OK I don't play stud (I am one Cool

) but I can can recognize that neither passing the button or not burning cards has any effect on the game. So your statement that this is not real stud and you can't gain anything from it is , is, someone give me a word here, preposterous.

Yes, you did not get the cards that you would have but as you don't know what those cards were and you play what you have and what you think your opponent has it doesn't matter. Burning cards is not there to effect the game but to make it harder to cheat. It removes the top card off from the deck in case someone knew what that card was before the betting.

Passing the button has no effect either and as many people have expressed different opinions here on how it has been done in past games it is obvious that no one but you thinks it has a relevance.

I'm wondering here, have you at anytime in your life used the phrase, "ya, maybee you are right?"

Keep up the good work keeping us all honest but just give some thought that at some point in your life you may be wrong once or twice. Very Happy

Dave
_________________
I'm a super donky that still plays better poker than Tim

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

There are rules to all games... without rules you don't have a game and you end up with mass chaos.... Rules are what define one game from another. For instances in Hold'em you get two hole... which is different from Omaha where you get 4 hole cards. That is a difference that defines Texas Hold'em from Omaha. So with that said rules espescially in any poker game is paramount to defining that specific game. I've played a fair amount of stud online even though they were only play money tournaments I would be willing to bet that I have more stud expereience then just about anyone posting with exception of maybe Jason.

You don't have to listen to me. You can play by your own rules if you want. Don't expect me to want to participate again and when it does turn out that I am right don't pretend like I didn't say anything or for heaven sakes just nut up and say you're sorry. Please stop passing off the game we played at Tim's house this past Saturday as a stud game because it was a far cry from it. It wasn't like I was about to take my $50 back and leave so I just sat and played and tried to have fun.... the consequence is you have to deal with me now... because you were all wrong. Since I had to sit and listen to all of you ignorantly quote what you thought were the real rules of stud I get to smugly smile and say you're all wrong now.... end of story. No one has to like it... the bottom line is there are specific rules to the poker game called stud which defines it from any other poker game wheather you play it at a home game or in a casino.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

resonator · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:36 am Post subject:

I agree with Dave ... if the cards are properly randomized then it makes no difference where the deal starts. A burn card is to eliminate cheating, but in the regular league games sometimes the dealer burns the card for NLHE before the betting action happens. I'm sure that's just because the respective dealer who is doing that isn't generally a dealer and not because he's looking for a "marked" card. I can assure you nobody is trying to stack an 8 handed game of Stud.

I've played blackjack with nits who would complain about players hitting when they shouldn't and "taking their card" that would have given them 21. Well, that card was just as likely, statistically speaking, to be a face card that busted their hand and the next card being the card that gave them 21.

When we were 3 handed at League Eddie and Bert were in a hand that Bert was dealing and Bert was absent mindedly shuffling the deck. We just burned and turned like normal, because although a different flop came out it was still a "randomized" flop. Discussions like this are for supersticious nits in my opinion.
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-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

resonator · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:40 am Post subject:

OK, how's this ... Tom you're completely right, the button doesn't move and the first chair always recieves the first card off the deck and bring in is determined by suit in case of a tie and there is always a burn card between rounds of betting ... However it makes absolutely no difference, but if we need to play stud that way in order for you to grace us with your company I say we should play stud acording to hoyle.
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

Big T · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:12 pm Post subject:

I vote next time we play stud that Tom will get the deal for the whole time. That way he will have control over the entire game.

So if it wasn't Stud on saturday then I want my money back because Eric wouldn't have gotten the Full House, that you asked for him to check (Lord knows why you would ask someone to check a hand that they believed was not the winner) but then I wouldn't have gotten my flush so it is all a wash.

So if it wasn't Stud was it Razz? Seemed to be by the cards I was getting.
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Todd H.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Again Bruce I had to sit and listen to at least 4 people ignorantly yell at me that I didn't know the rules to stud were... you don't burn cards between streets and you do move the button. Stud is actually considered a buttonless poker game. Of course if you put yourself in my shoes you can understand why I might be on meds now... with at least 4 people yelling ignorantly at me the wrong rules of stud poker I could have been convinced I was going insane and I landed in bizaro world.
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A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

I suggested calling it GRAMPA's version of stud... its long but its not any real version of stud.... too many missed rules of stud to call it anything close to stud. I can change the rules of a simple game of tag... instead of running around how about I close my eyes and count to 10 and then I'll try to find you... we'll still call it tag even though all the rules have change and it really sounds like hide and go seek....

We played a poker game on Saturday but it wasn't stud... it was a hybrid of hold'em and stud... we should call it Stold'em.

Actually a better analogy is that we combined holdem and stud so it would be like combinding tag and hide and go seek... so I'll count to 10 and you do whatever you feel like doing so you don't get tagged. If you want to hide go for it if you feel like out running me thats cool too.
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

Oh here is another idea... try playing some stud games and get familar with the game first so that when you want to yell at me you have a leg to stand on. Once you've played enough of any stud game you'll start to realize that what we played was not stud....
_________________
A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

resonator · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:11 pm Post subject:

Besides this past Saturday I haven't played stud in FOREVER, but like I said before along with simple 5 card draw it's the game of poker that I grew up playing with my family before I ever played for any real money. There's generally an ante that everyone puts in before the hand is dealt also and not just the bring in that we were playing "for". In this particular set up that we had if we were playing strictly cash stud, it wouldn't have made any sense to play anything but PREMIUM hands like rolled up trips or a BIG pair in the hole or BIG split pair because there were no ante's and that doesn't force action. However, it was part of a tournament format and that lent itself to the looser play that we saw because we were trying to accumulate chips for the final table, so strictly speaking no it was not a "typical" stud game. If someone wanted to sit on their chips for the stud game and not play a single hand, they might have been forced to bring it in 3 or 4 times in the hour that we played and lost 75/100 chips, but obviously nobody was doing that. Especailly after the steamrolling that happened in Omaha everybody wanted chips to go after Ben with and there was looser play.

I don't know what you're talking about when you say that people were yelling at you that you didn't know the rules to stud. People only started to get annoyed when you wouldn't just drop it and play the game how it was set up and we had already been playing it for 7 or 8 hands. I had always played that the deal passed, but I've never played with a full time dealer and it was easier to split dealing responiblities and the 1 seat is ALWAYS to the left of the dealer so it de facto changes if the deal changes. I had always played with no burn, but I've never worried about anyone trying to cheat me in a stud game. I certainly didn't say you were wrong at the time because to be honest I didn't know one way or the other, but I did want you to drop it after a while because it's hard enough for me to play poker with all that yap, yap, yap of arguing going on in my ear. I mean for christ sake I almost mucked a full house I was so off my game I needed all the concentration I could muster.
_________________
-Eric

Homer: There's your giraffe, little girl.
Ralph Wiggum: I'm a boy.
Homer: That's the spirit. Never give up.

Spike · Donkey Joined: 03 Sep 2005 Posts: 1302

I was looking forward to playing stud... imagine my furstration when I found out it wasn't stud we were playing and worst of all I can't make my case for the real rules because no one cares enough to stop and think about it or talk about. Just stubborn people telling me to drop it because I was wrong. Again its not like I could request my money back so I did eventually decide to make the best of it and make my case later.

so put yourself in my shoes... I was looking forward to stud but the rules change no one wanted to listen and I could request my money back... exactly -beep- that shit is what I said to.... but I bit my tounge and sat quietly.
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A true test of a poker player isn't what hand he will make a call with but what hand he will fold when he knows he is beat.

theoriginalDave · 是我是donk Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 883

I think the game of tag was a great analogy, except that in your example you changed the premise of the game. I see the same game of tag here, but we have a kid with only one leg so we decide to hop around instead of run. It's still tag because we haven't change the basic premise of the game.

I guess in your neighborhood you spent the whole afternoon arguing that the kid couldn't play tag so there was no use even trying. I'm also guessing you didn't have many friends but you always won the argument.

Dave
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I'm a super donky that still plays better poker than Tim

brucel · GRAMPA Royalty Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 2148

CableGuy · GRAMPA's Badass Ninja Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 1091

Exactly what money did you put on the game?

As far as I'm concered you can shut the fuk up. Tom you are a ignorant asshole. No one had a problem with the way it was played, as far as i am concered you can not come to the games if your going to be an asshole.